Arya Samaj

Shishya · Posted: Tue Aug 29, 2006 4:28 pm Post subject:

Namaste PD,

Why not just have several sections, each one devoted to the varying views of different groups in regards to Manu Smriti? That seems like the most even-handed approach to me. I don't think you can satisfy everyone with one single point of view, and if you try, you lose depth.

Anyways, let's get this thread back on topic, shall we? Laughing

_________________
Namaste,

Shishya
ॐ

ॐ सह नावतु । सह तौ भुनक्तु । सह वीर्यं करवावहै । तेजस्वि नावधीतमस्तु मा विद्विषावहै ॥
"Together may we be protected. Together may we be profited. Together may we do a hero's work. May we learn intelligently. May we never hate one another."
-Brihadaranyaka & Taittiriya Upanishads

ramkish42 · Posted: Tue Aug 29, 2006 8:57 pm Post subject:

Related to the OP

This is evolution as seen

1. Matsya - Pisces
2. Kurma - Amphibians
3. Varaaha - Vertebrates
4. Nrusimha - Beastly man
5. Vaamana - Normal Man

Human evolution chain proceeds as follows

6. Parasu Raama - Aggresive and violent, might is right
7. Sri Raama - Soft and Dharmic minded, spreading dharma by leading as example
8. Bala Rama - Dharmic Minded, aggressive in imposing dharma, aggressive nature on imposing indicating degrading dharmic values
9. Sri Krishna - Dharmic Minded, however flexing dharma to suit the need, flexing nature indicates further degrading of dharmic values, confusion everywhere with many contradictory works
10 Kalki - Resetting original dharma
_________________
Thanks and regards,

Ramkish

Shishya · Posted: Tue Aug 29, 2006 9:47 pm Post subject:

Namaste Ramkish,

So, based on your post, can I assume that Vaishnavas realize the stories in their scriptures are to be understood allegorically? That would be news to me. In the past I have only encountered Vaishnavas that follow works such as the Srimad Bhagavatam to the letter.

Is this a view of evolution particular to you, or is it common among Vaishnavas?
_________________
Namaste,

Shishya
ॐ

ॐ सह नावतु । सह तौ भुनक्तु । सह वीर्यं करवावहै । तेजस्वि नावधीतमस्तु मा विद्विषावहै ॥
"Together may we be protected. Together may we be profited. Together may we do a hero's work. May we learn intelligently. May we never hate one another."
-Brihadaranyaka & Taittiriya Upanishads

ramkish42 · Posted: Tue Aug 29, 2006 10:49 pm Post subject:

This is just a thought that occured in my mind earlier over other forum when the question of evolution cropped up.

I just posted the same over here.

Vaishnavs and Bhagavatam, yes, you will find many gaudiya vaishnavs stick to bhagavatam and gita, as if they are not aware of existence of any other texts. That shows their love towards the said works

I belong to srivaishnava sect, popularised by Shrimad Ramanujaacharyar, follower of visishtadvaita, hence my thoughts normally would differ from brahma madhava gaudiya sampradaaya

We do not subscribe to goloka, garbodakasayi and kriyodakasayi thoughts.
_________________
Thanks and regards,

Ramkish

Shishya · Posted: Tue Aug 29, 2006 11:00 pm Post subject:

Namaste Ramkish,

Can I take that as a 'yes' to my first question? Smile

_________________
Namaste,

Shishya
ॐ

ॐ सह नावतु । सह तौ भुनक्तु । सह वीर्यं करवावहै । तेजस्वि नावधीतमस्तु मा विद्विषावहै ॥
"Together may we be protected. Together may we be profited. Together may we do a hero's work. May we learn intelligently. May we never hate one another."
-Brihadaranyaka & Taittiriya Upanishads

Prabhat · Posted: Wed Aug 30, 2006 12:06 am Post subject:

Are yaar, you guys use a lot of hindi words, and difficult english words. Confused

dont wory, i will learn it soon Wink

_________________
Namaste,
Prabhat

Prabhat · Posted: Wed Aug 30, 2006 12:16 am Post subject:

Shishya · Posted: Wed Aug 30, 2006 5:44 am Post subject:

Namaste,

As we seem to be drifting off-topic, I thought I would start a new thread devoted to Manu Smriti which can be found by clicking here. Please direct any further discussion of Manu Smriti to this new thread.

This thread will remain devoted to discussing the Theory of Evolution as a whole.
_________________
Namaste,

Shishya
ॐ

ॐ सह नावतु । सह तौ भुनक्तु । सह वीर्यं करवावहै । तेजस्वि नावधीतमस्तु मा विद्विषावहै ॥
"Together may we be protected. Together may we be profited. Together may we do a hero's work. May we learn intelligently. May we never hate one another."
-Brihadaranyaka & Taittiriya Upanishads

Shyena · Posted: Wed Aug 30, 2006 6:07 am Post subject:

I'm trying to find a detailed article related to Samkhya Philosophy that i encountered before. Even the wikipedia article will help in this topic (no, i didn't mess about with this one).

From what i can remember, samkhya philosophy ignores ishwara as its prime motive is to discriminate between purusa and prakrti. Either the sutras or their commentaries suggest that the cosmos and solar system etc.. evolved because of purusa itself - in the sense, the earth has its spirit and so does the sun; and they evolved into the state we know today due to evolution of purusa.

What i dont understand is - why aren't we taught that indians already proposed evolution!

Ramkish, with all due respect - this forum is arya samaji; and the arya samajists reject puraanas and certain other scriptures so it is best we abstain from discussing anything related to puraanas. I'm also sanatana dharmik (advaitin, smartha sampradaya) and I abstain from such topics as well ^_^

Prabhat · Posted: Wed Aug 30, 2006 6:11 am Post subject:

Shyena · Posted: Wed Aug 30, 2006 6:18 am Post subject:

I wasn't criticising ramkish - what i'm saying is that when samkhya philosophy clearly teaches us evolution - infact is a major postulate, yet we aren't taught about it!

Prabhat · Posted: Wed Aug 30, 2006 6:19 am Post subject:

Shyena · Posted: Wed Aug 30, 2006 6:25 am Post subject:

we're taught that the west came up with the concept of evolution first by some frenchman then by charles darwin.....

Fact is that we came up with the concept of evolution first and it was much more refined for its times.

Prabhat · Posted: Thu Aug 31, 2006 12:24 am Post subject:

Shyena · Posted: Sun Sep 03, 2006 9:49 am Post subject:

It would be difficult to explain that until i find a good article explaining samkhya philosophy.
Samkhya philosophy basically ignores concept of ishvara, by saying that everything in the universe - from organisms to galaxies - evolved out of evolution by the union of purusha(consciousness) with prakrti(matter-cum-energy). It doesn't howver stick to the concept of natural selection, it is simply progressive evolution; which periodically also shows decline in progress into apah(water). It supports the yuga concept.

Shishya · Posted: Sun Sep 03, 2006 1:28 pm Post subject:

Namaste PD,

I, too, am looking for a good article related to Samkhya. However, I have also thought it might be a good idea to write something myself, perhaps comparing several 'evolutionary systems' found in Indian philosophy. I was thinking it would be interesting to compare and contrast traditional Samkhya (i.e. that of Ishvarakrishna), Patanjali's system, Sankara's system and Traitavada of Swami Dayanand. If you run across a good article on Samkhya, please do send me a link in a PM and we will get a thread started on it. Wink

Also, I thought one other distinction between Vedic 'evolution' and that of Darwin might be worth mentioning. In Darwin's evolution, random mutation plays a central role. Samkhya (or any 'evolutionary' system in Vedic thought) however, claims the opposite, i.e. that no 'mutation' could ever be considered 'random'.
_________________
Namaste,

Shishya
ॐ

ॐ सह नावतु । सह तौ भुनक्तु । सह वीर्यं करवावहै । तेजस्वि नावधीतमस्तु मा विद्विषावहै ॥
"Together may we be protected. Together may we be profited. Together may we do a hero's work. May we learn intelligently. May we never hate one another."
-Brihadaranyaka & Taittiriya Upanishads

Shyena · Posted: Sun Sep 03, 2006 2:31 pm Post subject:

Namaste Shishya,
Yes i know that Samkhya is opposed to Darwinianism Smile

that's why i said "progressive evolution" unlike "natural selection"

In satyarth prakash and manu smrti the cosmic evolution has been described to a certain extent (agni from apah etc)

I'd have to find some good sankhya sutras to seek the explanation of samkhya evolution

Prabhat · Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2007 1:33 pm Post subject:

Namaste,

Maby Niranjan, can explain more over the evolution here, than to start a new topic.
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Namaste,
Prabhat

Prabhat · Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 12:05 am Post subject:

Shishya · Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 12:23 am Post subject:

Namaste Prabhat Ji,

Ohhh.....this is one of those things I have been meaning to do but have been tied up with other stuff. The short answer: No, I haven't written that article yet. The somewhat longer answer: I have spent some time thinking about the phenomenon which the theory of evolution tries to explain and how this would be explained from a Vedic point of view. Though the exact answer is still formulating in my head, it has to do with the 'evolutionary' process souls undergo in their development/purification towards the human stage. That probably doesn't say much to you now, but I will try and come up with a clearer formulation of it in the near future.

Thanks, however, for reminding me of this important topic. Wink

_________________
Namaste,

Shishya
ॐ

ॐ सह नावतु । सह तौ भुनक्तु । सह वीर्यं करवावहै । तेजस्वि नावधीतमस्तु मा विद्विषावहै ॥
"Together may we be protected. Together may we be profited. Together may we do a hero's work. May we learn intelligently. May we never hate one another."
-Brihadaranyaka & Taittiriya Upanishads

Prabhat · Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 11:33 pm Post subject:

Namaste Shis,

koi bhaat nahai, i wil keep reminding you Wink

_________________
Namaste,
Prabhat

Ashokakirti · Freshman Member Joined: 15 Aug 2008 Posts: 16

Hi Folks!!
If you do not mind, I have some questions. How do we know that there is GOD and the GOD created us? In fact, what is GOD exactly?

thanks!